Heal the Soul, Restore the Calm with Stephan Moccio
Mhm. Yeah, They love you. Hey, everybody out there in Internet land. Good morning or good afternoon. Evening, wherever you are. I'm Chase Jarvis. You're hosting guide, founder and CEO of Creative Live, and we're gonna have some fun over the next 60 to 90 minutes. This broadcast today has been, I think, somewhere routine two and four years in the making. And it brings me a lot of joy to share this particular guest with you today. Um, it's gonna be a mix of performance and conversation. And before I get into our esteemed guest, I would like to cover a couple of housekeeping things, which is, if you are out there in the Internet and you'd like to participate in the conversation helped shape it, feel free to chime in with comments and questions. Wherever you are, whatever platform you're watching, the best experience is going to be at creative live dot com slash tv. If you click, join, chat. I see those comments first in nearly real time from everywhere on the planet. But if you're watchin...
g on Facebook, live YouTube, live instagram, live periscope, any of the other number of platforms of broadcast, I do see your comments as well. Just maybe 2030 seconds delayed on. I'd like to start off this morning by hearing from you wherever you are on the planet. Type in your geography, your location. Eso I know that we in fact, have a global audience that I believe we have. If I'm starting to see some names and locations trickling in here, that gives me a lot of joy on DWhite. While you all are spooling that up from around the planet, I'm going to introduce our esteemed guest after writing chart topping hits for the likes of Celine Dion ever Levin Seal and Josh Groban, My dear friend, Multi Grammy and Academy Award nominated composer songwriter producer Stefan Macchio is joining us today for a conversation and a performance to cover a lot of ground with respect to Creative Process connection and in part to announce his debut album on Decca Records. The album is called Tales of Solis, which comes out on the 28th of August. This is a super provocative album have had the chance to listen to it super tender piano meditations that both inspire and soothe soul. Ah, I, my ability to describe the album, uh, would pale in comparison to a performance. So I would like to invite our guest today to open the broadcast with a little performance from his home in sunny Los Angeles, California. Please welcome Stefan Macchio. Mhm. I chase. Welcome to the show, man. I was my spine. The hairs on the back of my neck were standing up. Um, thank you so much for being on the show, man. Literally years in the making and congratulations on the new album years. Um, I just before we get started. I mean, um, I started watching you on. I think it was Apple when you were promoting their software aperture. Wow, that was a decade ago. That's that's when I said, this guy gets it. Uh, you know, he just gets it from a creative perspective. Um, and then a lifestyle perspective. And then from that moment on, for the last I think 34 years, you've been my very best invisible friend in my ears. As I work out every day of the club, I think I've listened to every podcast of yours. Um, and here we are. Finally, this is full, full circle, and we have a mutual friend in Michael's survey, um, your episode on his podcast finding mastery was so impressive and inspiring. Um, your ability to make the piano work is like few I have ever seen. And when I started pursuing all of your different social channels uh, the artistry the, um, empathy, the connection that you bring to not just the process, but to the music, the performance of the music. Um, always, seemingly drinking red wine Got the French films in black and white projecting in the background. Um, I was, you know, hoping that and for those who don't know how this stuff works, you know, you've got a new album out, and there's labels and managers and all kinds of stuff that, uh, of course, they wanna take care of their artists. And, um, but we were happy to jump through the hoops to enable you to play. So I want to first thank you for starting off with a little ah, little performance. I hope we have. Uh, well, I'll say we have plans for a couple of more tracks across the next 60 minutes or so. Um, but before we do that, I want to go a little bit into your background because so many people find their way into creativity into music and performance, Um, in different ways. And the more that I investigate this, the more I look under the hood of my own experience is the experience is the people on the podcast on CREATIVELIVE. To me, that's part of what's so beautiful is that there is no one path and your path. Uh, I would describe, just from reading your bio on what I confined from your management and online and a little bit that I do know about you personally is that you started at a very young age. And I'm hoping you can walk us through that. Yeah. I mean, I'll try to give you the skinny. Um, I think now that I'm a older human being, um, well, into my forties, I've been in pursuit of the truth through music my entire life. I think. Let me take you back Started piano lessons when I was three years old. Three to be three, uh, years old. I mean, it Z shortly after, it was like walking and then piano. Um, but it's it's I come from a musical family that's the thing. So I come, uh, French mother, French, Canadian mother, Italian father, and, uh, I've been blessed in that. I come from a household where music is expected in the arts is expected. So it was always massage back, you know, back in my household, where I had a lot of friends who, who their parents would shun upon them if they said they wanted to pursue career music because even to make a living in music, I think it's like less than 1% of the musicians in the world who can. And so I had a very supportive household. My brother's a musician himself as well. He's a music teacher now in school. Um, so it all everybody was a pianist on my mom's side. My grandmother, my aunt, you know, my brother myself. And of course, I went through the wringer all like back in Toronto. We called the Royal Conservatory of Music. The RCM and, um, just put in my time, like, literally put in my time over the years. I mean, I think that's you know, I'm a late bloomer in that I finally, you know, t even consider myself and to say, humbly that I feel like I've finally mastered this instrument. You know, Like I said, I'm in my mid forties and I've been playing this instrument for over 42 years, so it's kind of crazy. Andi, when you put your put your 10,000 hours in, um, but the piano's been extension of who I am. It's just it's just literally, uh, I'm so comfortable with it now it's I probably communicate better through the keys than I do with words. Um, that's what I was trying to capture in the intro right where we were. I'm like, I don't I need to stop talking because just the piano speaking through your fingers is a much better. There's a much better job than I ever could e. I wish I could walk around, have a communication and dialogue with people with a piano on time, but I can't do that. Um, but you know, throughout the course of doing that, having grown up on Canadian, I grew up in south of Toronto and Niagara Falls, and I grew up listening to a lot of American pop culture radio. So So I was, you know, being immersed in the conservatory side of things with the class of training. And at the same time, I had this love, this passion for pop music and so that the dichotomy of both genres, um, was something that I really became known for. But I I knew early on that the discipline that you have in learning an instrument, I didn't want to stop becoming the best classical pianist I could. So I got my degree in classical music in performance and composition, Um, and me all. I mean, while I was doing studio work, you know, as a 17 18 19 year old that became a session player, uh, then became a you know, a well known session player in Toronto for Sony Music. And I was performing on a lot of big records at the time, and at the same time, I was studying conducting with the Toronto Symphony Orchestra. So it was. It was just wild and in my nighttime gig, just kind of keep things going. It was the lounge piano player, the Four Seasons Hotel, and and and then for three years, I would I literally play the piano from 5 to 7 30 every night in the lounge Monday through Saturday and I got hired to perform for a lot of the big the tiff the Toronto International Film Festival. They would hire me for like Elton John came to town and hired me to play his party. Um, Tom Hanks, you know, it was it was It was a really early introduction into sort of that Hollywood scene, if you will, Where all of a sudden you said that you're playing. And, you know, one day I was playing and staying walked in and sat down with me to just just beside me. Um, and I was a kid, you know? I was 18 19 at the time, years old, and I was pounding away. But But I'm all this to say that I I learned the American songbook, and it's sort of like by osmosis by learning Cole Porter. Um, you know it Z misty e e. All these great songs, um, just got into my fingers and got into my blood and, you know, eventually graduated and nice to started writing hits, and I became a, you know, an arranger producer for Sony Music. And my first big hit was with Celine Dion Song. I co wrote with Aldo Nova. Uh, it was called The New Days Come and Global hit around the world. Those kind of songs change your life and they give you, um, if anything, they give you the opportunity to sort of start to say no a lot more and not choose the B roll movies just to make a living. If that makes any sense. Sure. And that was I'm giving you a context. I was in my mid to late twenties when I popped my first, like Number one global hit with Selene and I had already burnt out. I think I was, you know, programming, arranging music, Um, barely sleeping, working the job at the Four Seasons. And then all of a sudden, those kind of songs like I said, provide you with a different level of income. And I felt for many years people they were asking me what is a good chill piano album to listen to? And and there's a lot of incredible piano players you know, Oscar Peterson, Bill Evans, and there's a handful of some good New Age contemporary piano players. But I couldn't think of one at the time, and I I said. You know what? I'm going to take my own little mini sabbatical that time and write my own sort of album that people could, you know, be in love, to cook, to read, to be introspective, too, if that makes any sense. Andi. That was over 10 years ago, and it was a roaring hit in Canada with Universal music, and it became a number one album on the classical and pop charts, and it became, sort of, I guess, the genesis of now. Tales of solace years later. But okay, now 14 years like I love that just like that in there. Absolutely. But there's a big gap in between. So in between there I moved to L. A. And life becomes a nab salute Whirlwind for me here. Um, you know, I think fee Within six days of moving here, I had co written a song called Wrecking Ball From Miley Cyrus and his number one globally and my life spinning furniture hadn't yet arrived from Toronto. Um, yeah, that was a family. Two kids just trying. They were Everybody was sleeping on the floor, the furniture hadn't arrived, and everybody wants to get in the room with, um, the person who has the number one song in the world. And And listen, if, if anything, I want to share with your community is that, you know, there is such a thing, that's creative burnout. You know, when I had a still string of hits 78 years ago, my publisher was put me in the room hoping that would create another one. And what you don't realize is that hits. You can't explain the the ingredients in the magic formula creating a hit song. They just happen. You gotta be prepared for it. And I you know, they wanted me to write a song a day, and I just I don't operate that way. Some people do, but you have to save your really You have to preserve your great ideas and hold on to them for the right opportunity. That's what I've learned over the last decade. Plus, and so, you know, I'm back at the piano. I mean, you know, we can talk about that in a second. Why? I decided to come back. But anyway, I hope that's, uh, no, this is a beautiful trait. And let's just go back. Maybe 120 seconds to the period where you're talking about. You know, you are a studio musician. You're performing basically eight hours a day, and then you're going to the Four Seasons at night. I mean, that's like so many folks. You know, the classic. What is it? 10 year overnight success or 10,000 hours? All these things you've heard. But you don't actually understand what that looks like on a day to day level. It's easy to say the words 10,000 hours. And and yet, if you look at the lives of yourself of the Beatles of Lady Gaga, so much time is put in mastering. Yes, so much time, which requires that you enjoy the process. So talk to me about the process that you go through. Presumably, this is enjoyable most of the time. And as you said, I'd like to put a pin in the burnout because that's a real thing we want to talk about in a second. But talk to me about the love of the process of creating music. I mean, I my second passion is probably photography and architecture on. Bring that up because there's an element of composition in it. Um, But the only thing that's going to get you through those those dark nights, the constant rejection, constant rejection and and people looking at you sideways, for example, when you come with come to them with an idea or a song and you think you think that's a hit, Um, you know, ask me. I still think so. My best work sitting on a shelf unpublished and and you know, But you know, what do I know? And then all of a sudden, you know, you walk into a room one day and you literally, uh, you know, in three hours you write a song called Wrecking Ball and with two people that you don't know and it changes your life yet again. Um, but your question was, your s been us specifically about your process, the process loving the process, and in order to let me just give you a brutish example. I loved taking photographs such that I could put film in my camera, you know, and a handful of roles in my pocket and just walk and just walk into the woods and take pictures for hours. This is when no one's watching. This is There's no fans cheering you on. There's no time pressure. There's no This is a love of the process of composition and creating and experimenting and making mistakes and recovering. And you know that to me, that is a It's a requirement for, um for I think for greatness or for mastery in any field. I want to know what your experience of the process of playing the piano is, Is it? You know, clearly, if you're going to do something for 12 hours a day, you have to enjoy it. Was it Was there a pressure there? Was there a joy there? Was there a an abandoned Was it like where you, you know, how did you reconcile all of the hours with, um, you know your love for the music? I think, as I mentioned to you before, I mean, my relationship with this instrument, the piano is eso intimate? Um, I probably had a conversation with this instant more than anyone in my entire life. Like like I've spent the most time with this living, breathing piece of wood more than anyone in my life. Um, my process, in a lot of ways, as early as I I was probably 10 or 11 when I started to understand the relationship between notes. So when I saw that this thes created basic chords of music, all of a sudden I would start to just make my own mistakes at the instrument and develop my own language, my own harmonic language, and I just Sometimes we'll just just sit down, have a conversation. I'll do this for 23 hours on, and and that sort of, uh, but the prelude to my process even in recording piano music, you know, a lot of people ask me, I go out of my way to record off the click for people don't understand what that means. In pop music, you have a rigid you record to a metronome or in a computer. So you got now in piano music. I mean, um, I wanted to come back, you know, after being involved, producing co writing these massive, massive songs with sometimes north of 100 tracks with orchestras to the reductive element of the piano. Just one. It's like one individual myself talking a piece of wood and myself just kind of hearing my own thoughts again. So because I have a nice studio and it's my own studio. I could sit and have this conversation and record and just put my hands down at the piano on play for hours and then listen to myself and edit what I think is the best part of that conversation and have a piece of music be that raw. I mean tales of solace on this album. Every there's nothing that's punched in in this album. It's everything is just literally a stream of consciousness, and I hear it when I hear other piano players. I kind of go, uh, that individuals using a click or that person is not. And, you know, we could sit here and philosophizes that the world has needed, uh, room to breathe. I mean, here we are. We're all quarantined right now, But pre quarantine my my creed, was bring the reduction, reduction reduction. My world was too busy. My world was too big. I moved to L. A and and success happened and I was just like, I fucking can't take this anymore. I just I just I just want to hear myself think again, which is why silence and peace and solace there so important to me. I like I strive to protect my creative time. I strive to protect my time alone at the instrument because it's it's one of the few things that brings me Just just, you know, allows myself, you know, hear myself thought that my my thoughts etcetera, etcetera, So yeah, well, let me let me let you know some We got people coming in from all over the world. We've got England, We've got South Africa, We've got Arizona. Um, a couple of folks charming in. Just wanted to say some nice things. Um, Espacio says congratulations. Love your exposure album. Part of the hey, Jeffs Lebowski out there. Nice to see you guys. Um, Stefan is a genius. Derek says that's from YouTube. Yes. Um, okay. A little bit about your process. We touched on that. I want to go forward now. Let's say 10 years to being blocked. You talked about putting in all your time. And speaking of time, um, Mayor M ai r says I'm in the beginning of my process after 20, hours. So we've got you know, we've got you've mastered your instrument. You've been playing 10 hours a day for 20 years. And how do you How do you make the time that you have with that with your piano? How do you make it special? Because at some point you you know you get blocked, you have a couple of hits and you know what we call and what they say in sports is the sophomore jinx, right? Or I guess that's even in music. The album, like the second album, is always hard. Eso You've had this first wave of success, let's say pre moving to L. A. How do you keep going when things are tough? Um, it's It's an excellent question. I know you had David Foster. Um it was a friend and mentor of mine on the show recently, and David Haye called me up after my first hit. Uh, you know, 15 years ago with Selena, he says, Congratulations. Now you're second one is gonna be even more difficult. And he was right. There was actually a gap in between that makes any sense, and and however I was probably more prolific in that gap, I was more creative than I ever was. And, um, I really enjoyed your interview with Steve Aoki lately recently as well. And and Steve said something very true. Um, and I just said it earlier is Ah, lot of times people think because you see the streaming number if you go too. Stefan Market on Spotify. You see that? This song has, uh, eight million streams, and the other one only has 200,000. That's the eight million is better. And that's not the case. That's not the case. Um, but it z Jesus, I'm just getting sidetracked. Your child, You know I love it. No, I love it s So when when you're burned out or when someone like David Foster says, Hey, kid, good job. But get back to work is essentially What do you say to you? Right, uh, working and creativity to me. I don't know about everybody else. It is a muscle. Like there's I've written my biggest songs on the days that I was most uninspired, if that makes any sense. So I think walking into this room here, the studio, um, it's like going to the gym. I mean, you don't you don't want to get up in the morning necessarily, and do it, but And after you don't ever regret the after result. Like, you know, once you exercise, you don't say, uh, fuck I wish. Yeah, I wish I didn't hit the gym. No one said that ever. No, absolutely not. And the same thing with piano, Because I you know, even even though I love spending my time here, there's just kind of days where I kind of go. Why? You know, I just don't want to do this, but then all of a sudden, because I can come up with a million my head and be obsessed with it and work it through or the other way people ask me, how do you compose? I just literally put my fingers down, and then you kind of see what happens on E on, and you just go with it and and you go and you go and you go on. Next thing you know you may have, but that is just for anyone who is identifies as a creator. You felt these moments of flow and flow doesn't happen before you start. That's the thing that most people miss, right? And just, for example, you say, set my hands on the keys and then I see where it goes notice. You didn't say. I sat on the bench and looked at the keys. You know, you had to actually start doing something, and it's like the gym. You have to start moving your body and it Z, you can't I don't know to me this this act of doing I think it's interesting that every one of your when you when you have just touched the piano and played something beautiful, you know, a strong a couple of notes or chords together there for us. You know, you're always the first thing you're doing is touching your Actually, the act of creating inspires the next note. It's almost like you're pulling on a threat or walking down a path. Um, so part of hearing the piano makes me want to hear, hear more of the piano. So before we dio, I want you to start thinking about what track? Maybe off your new album, you might be willing to play for us. In the meantime, there's a bunch of questions. Um, well, first of all, it's important for me to say that John Bracey, your university professor, is on in the comments giving you a shoutout. I love trump all, um And but importantly, a question has just come up, um, about creating success for yourself. So those folks, Aer, Yes. We're all putting in our hours, Stefan, but how do we get noticed? Because you've spent, you know, 10% of the last 20 minutes, using words like Celine Dion and Sony Music and Universal. And these were all you know, global brands, um, tagged with, you know, multi platinum hits tagged with big dollars. And yet there's so many of us who are waiting for our break who are have not yet seen or found or connected with the person that can help us. We have not published enough music to be recognized as a master. We have not, you know, etcetera, etcetera. So in part for Mayor M ai r Prudence, What did you do in order to get recognized? Was it just a matter of showing up? Was it some? Was there some hacks trick? I know. And every there again, there's no formula to it, But you know, my mom, um, always told me, Do what you love and the money will follow. You know, I was I've been broke. Uh, many times you know, make a lot of money go broke. It's the classic spirit, the entrepreneur, Um, but you know, you and you have to have the stomach for it the thing. But you know a lot of us, you know, today, and I find I just I just generalize everybody. We want a shortcut to greatness without putting in the hours, right? You know, you know how many times the record labels come to me after after doing earned it for the weekend on They want that big orchestral fancy sound. But I know I'm not blaming labels, but they don't realize that. God damn, I mean, 30 years of my life, I've been studying Brahms and studying. You know, Shostakovich, you know, Mozart, Beethoven, deconstructing their scores, you know, late at night in the library and understanding the voicings and how to put, you know, violence together to make that sound. But, I mean, it just didn't happen overnight, and I don't you know, you know, that's the problem. A lot of people say, Oh, you make it, you know, you the great ones make it look easy. But you know, there's no such thing as geniuses. Well, I mean Mozart was called the genius John Williams. John Williams's best answer was No, I'm not a genius. I'm just a guy who works hard. That's all I do. I work so so hard and I work hard. Um, and and I'll never forget that I was. You have to be ready. You've said this as cliche, not not to you, but I'm saying this is a cliche quote. You have to be prepared to be uncomfortable. It's the same thing. I was ready and I have. Like I said, when I was a kid, I took the risk on me. I was taking the loans from the bank to get the microphones in order to create the song to sell the Solin Dion. I took the risk with my manager and you know, it wasn't it wasn't label on all of a sudden, people there to collect when you are successful and you learn a lot of great life lessons on the other side of success as well. And you know and another thing we could spend a whole podcast on is dealing with the balance of not having work. And the opposite is maintaining success, which is really really tough. But, um um, listen, I mean, I just again I go off on my my rant, but, well, is there any prescription other than just continuing to practice? Like, is it about in order to get noticed? And because I think the the we fall in love with rock stars because they pour their souls out on the stage for us. And yet if they're pouring their their souls out in their parents basement and no one ever hears that music or never, no one ever sees the, you know, they don't see the light of day or they're not intentionally putting themselves. You said you talked about taking risks, but I want to know specifically what are some things that you've done to put yourself in the arena to be in a place where other people who can because look, even though like you may consider yourself a solo artist and this goes to anyone out there, Nothing happens in a vacuum. Everything requires a community. And so I'm curious as our, um, Sky and Stella and Gina and John An Alley and Shanti a who are tuning in from all over the world want to know how What did you do specifically to build some community to put yourself in the right rooms to get the attention that you have clearly received? I mean, you just said it there at the end to get in the room, the right room with the right people. Um and I may I may shoot myself in the foot for saying this, but we also live in a different age. But, you know, again, I'm aging myself. But back in the day, pre YouTube, pre Internet instagram and all that stuff, um, you physically had to be in a big city. So in Canada, I I grew up like I said in a small town called Niagara Niagara Falls, Niagara on the lake. And it was self the Toronto. But I knew that I had to get myself to Toronto as fast as possible, Okay? Because it was the mecca of Canadian pop culture. But I also knew in the back of my mind that Toronto a God bless I love, love my hometown. Um, if I want to go all the way, I had to move the Hollywood eventually. At some point, um, and I could know the proofs in the pudding. A thing is, you know, I'm a big believer in being in the same room with somebody. Um, if you live in a small town, you have to use the tools. You don't have the finances. Of course you have to use that. We mean, we live in an era now where you can crack. I mean, Bieber. Justin Bieber is from a small little town outside of Toronto, Ontario. I mean, he got discovered one of the biggest pop stars today. Now, um, but people want to know how they how they break it in. Um, you know, for me, it happened. You know, for example, a great story was when I don't already had I wrote an Olympic theme for Vancouver. I have to say that and that's, you know, that's Z become. It's it's becomes part of a national, not your national pride. And you hit a ceiling once you write a new Olympic theme for your nation. And at that point, it was I was looking at myself sideways and saying, I have no place else to go other than Hollywood. Um and and I say Hollywood in that, um you know, I wrote a song, Covered a song with the weekend called Earned It and had I Not Been Living Here Chase When I got the call from Sam Taylor Johnson, the director of that film, when they were spotting their end credit song and they needed something that sounded like Marvin Gaye and had a you know, Oldfield, I I couldn't show up to that spotting session in that screening room within 45 minutes. I wouldn't be nominated for an Academy Award. I wouldn't have performed with, you know, able we wouldn't we wouldn't have the grams like none of that would have happened if I wasn't geographically living in Los Angeles. So, you know, short answer is get yourself to L. A. Get yourself to New York, get yourself to London. I mean, you know, Berlin. I'm just that the big cities in the world that that that have culture, the big cities that have connections, um, you can crack with social media, but the thing is, relationships are everything. As you know, it's people, and it's like not until they hear you living, breathing in the same room. That magic really starts to happen. It's, uh so anyhow, Speaking of relationships, I would love to hear a little bit more about your relationship with the instrument sitting next to you there. Um, and again, if you're just joining, I want to say, Welcome to this gigantic. Now we got I think I'm counting. We're in the 30. Some 20 20 different geography is including states and countries. So we're probably, um it's fair to say global. I wanna welcome you. I'm with Stefan Macchio and we are about to hear a couple of new tracks or tracks rather off his new album, Tales of Solace, which is coming out the 28th of August. And, um, this has been a couple of years in the making. And then when we decided that we could make it happen, we needed to, uh, you know, get all the jump through all the hoops that you could actually perform. So I'm going to stop talking and let you do what you do among the very best on the planet. And that is play the piano song called Fracture. And it literally just that. Fractures of a relationship. Oh mm. Going. Don't Don't let me stop you. Keep going. Give me one more give you one more song called, uh, would be, um a actually pertains to a town where Dracula's from and I e met someone special who opened my world to that, um here is would be, but wow. God, base. Oh, man, I'm, um maybe it just sounds extra extra good to me because I'm you know, we got a pipe directly. I just No, no, no, no. That's the hairs on my arms are standing up. I'll play, I'll play a few more, But I just You know, I just thought about this as I was playing. I wanted to explain to people all the musical people on this on this particular broadcast here, what's special about this piano? Um, you know, people don't realize they I get a lot of messages asking me What is your piano Have a velvety, muted sound and stuff like that. And I have, ah, great relationship with Yamaha pianos. This is one of their like premier upright pianos, but more importantly, there's a piece of felt in here. So So, for example, if I lift this up and I play that same piece that I just did listen to how abrasive it sounds, man. Mhm, keep or with, anyhow, two for that. But just what that sounds like to me stuff that sounds like mastery. That sounds like knowing your language. Enough. You've You've played enough to have your own voice. And that's the question that I'm seeing a lot of the comments here again. They're starting to move a little bit faster than I can keep track of them. I'm screen cabin them so I can remember. But how did you develop your voice? Is it time? Is it, um, like when you know, something's truly yours you talked about, you know, studying the masters and deconstructing their work. And And how does that translated into you? Finding your own voice And you know, e guess? Yeah. Just finding your voice and and creating that personal style that you just demonstrated so perfectly for us. Um, again, uh, great question. You know, through the years in my entire life. And I still do this, I'll do this to the day I die. But, you know, there's a million ways I'm playing a c major scale. I'm just now giving a masterclass in music. But, I mean, you know, to spice that up. You can actually change the inside of the that cord where it make it sound a little more interesting. And that just comes with the years and, you know, hours and just kind of seeing trial and error. What works, What doesn't work, messing up the sound. I mean, there's really nothing wrong you could do it. The piano. There's just more pleasant sounds that you can create. There's, you know, every sound. You can go like that or you can go like, like on, you know, But it's just seeing what works. And the relationships between E No. A trick that people ask me a lot of times is how can you transpose on the spot? Um, and you know so fast. I mean, there's patterns in the keyboard that I that I see. There's just It's like a puzzle in a lot of ways. And once you kind of decode the instrument you can like, you could do literally anything. I mean, you know, for all the music was out there, I mean, Cole Porter, one of the greatest songwriters of all time. Could Onley play in one key G Flat major and people go God G flat major is murder like? No, it's not. It's actually one of the easiest keys to play. Even Dio do a scale in G flat, major. But Cole Porter was not trained, and he just wrote, you know, like, you know, I'm dreaming of a white Christmas. Um, yeah, eso all in the same key and then eventually, the you know, the arrangers transposed it for him. But, uh, so that z So all that to say I developed my own musical language. I mean, David Foster from the pop side of things. I e listen to his records for years and and then eventually just sort of made my own voice. Things happen. Um, is that and that is a product of repetition and and, you know, clearly practice. Sure, but how much of that came from fear? Like, was that a overnight that you just said? Okay, this is this is who I am, and this is my voice. Um what if I get it wrong? I'm trying to like, think of the the questions that we all all of us who identify as creators or entrepreneurs are sitting at home like Is this the rights is this, Um, I should I clean this? Is this my thing? How do you know if it's the right sound? How do I know? So what? What kind of language is going on in your head where I work? Yeah, I don't think you do know And you know, it's not like and I never woke up one day and said I wanted to be an artist. You know, it's I think, you know, it's just kind of in you. Um, I woke up and I as I became a student of music, I would listen to records, and I would sometimes get upset if I didn't hear an inversion or a court played the right way, Onda, where it could be played better. So all of a sudden, if you're going to complain about things, you actually have to take the matters in your own hand and and just do something about it. Otherwise just shut the fuck up. Excuse me, but it's It's like stop complaining. Um, so in the same, that same creed is I play. I applied to to music. If I'm going to sit there, you know how many times how many times have you are like of all of us, like SAT and said, How did that song makers to the radio And you kind of like, you know, And I say, I still say it today. I mean, you know, and that's why I sort of taking this sort of sabbatical for a minute from pop music because I was frankly getting tired of it. I just you know, I just pop music is intoxicating when it's amazing. And there's amazing pop writers. There's so much politics that, you know, put the wrong songs that radio on that commerce drives wrong art. So I said, You know what? I'm in a position again. Just shut up and just go back to the piano and and and and create something that you wanna listen to. That's it right there. That's the point, right? That's what Do you wanna listen? What do you want? Oh, like, what would you like to see? More of in the world? I wrote creative calling because there was a book that I didn't get when I needed it most. And I couldn't see it out there in the world. If you hear a song and it rubs you the wrong way. What's this song that you would replace it with? Whether this is a book of photographs, painting, piece of art, a piece of architecture, er thistle is where? Yeah, Go ahead. Sorry. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm just ranting because this is like, I think you just said it so eloquently. It's like, do the work. If you're seeing something out there and it doesn't, it doesn't sound right to you. What does sound right to you? And what can you do to put it out there in the world? You owe it to the world, especially, You know, if you are sitting there, uh, you know, sort of, um, lamenting in your brain about what's out there in the world. Go ahead, make something beautiful. Put it in. Put it out there if you're in a position of of some type of influence or power, um, it where people are actually listening to you, I think the older I get, the more difficult it becomes to be, You know, you have to honor that voice. You have to listen to it. Um, the older you get, you know, you just become your mortality is questions. So all of a sudden you're saying, Listen, if I don't do it now, I'm never going to do it, like, literally after after a certain point, um, you know, I'm gonna completely go onto something because there's something I want to show and share with our, you know, with with the community. Here is Let's just deconstruct one mega song that I've been part of. Um, you know, wrecking ball, for example. Okay, we have wrecking before. Before you deconstructed just play a few bars just to the people. Just like Okay, great. I'm reuniting with this song and then deconstructed person. Yeah, um, but wrecking ball in a lot of ways is a is a piece of classical music. I mean, just the course alone. I mean, it's a tender piano melody on, and it's almost like a piece of baroque music. And so when you actually stripped down the song itself and and Miley heard the song stripped down um, it wasn't, you know, the bombastic production that end up being, um it was she just heard a piano vocal. I mean, so I just I just again just wanted to show people that the elements. Every piece of information on a creative level is provided for you in the piano playing and the vocal for wrecking ball E o. But you, you know, on DSO Fourth and the rest is history. E bangs out global mega hit and the rest is history. Uh, speaking of history, you are about to make it with your first, uh, day solo debut album. What's it like to go from playing and performing music that you are collaborating with others on writing songs, producing songs for others and your name on your album out there in the world? Talk about the the movement from one space to this new space, which we I think some folks were putting the link to preorder your album available August 28th year. What's What's the gap there? Because that seems big to me. But let's I mean, can I just kind of take you back? When I decided I wanted to come back to the instrument eso after after being involved again with Miley and the weekend and a bunch of big hits, I was we were cutting strings in London, England in 2018 for cylinder on, and I was um, I have to remind people that I'm Canadian on, and I say that because Canada is a very interesting culture country. I'm sitting there waking up before the string section string session in London that day for Selene and classical music came on, and I just felt like an impostor a little bit in pop music for the longest time, you know, we can write our greatest songs and it was frustrating for producers, and we don't talk about the fact that I could pour myself in, and I believe I've written some even greater pop music that that hasn't been released. But the label, the management can all decide to nix it, and all of a sudden you're work doesn't go anywhere and that I experienced that frustration all the time. You've got my level every day for years. I mean, you know the amount of success I've had. I've had so much as much failure. So I was sitting there in London and it was so clear to me that I had to come back to the piano. It's just eso. I'm not doing this to be recognized. I'm do this because I feel that there's you know there's there's a lane that hasn't been taken over yet. I mean, this incredible pianist that I admire in this John Brothers, the Max Richter's There's Ludovico. Einaudi, Um, now's Fromm's. There's a lot of great players, but, um, I finally felt also is a man. And I say that, you know, I've had, well, perhaps the darkest and happiest year on your behalf, you know of my life, going through a lot of changes that I thought he felt. I had something to say. And again, I don't communicate through words. That's the beauty of this album. It's not. There's no words. It's international. It's universal because it communicates straight to the heart. It's how my fingers connect with the piano and and touch somebody in in in Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Australia and and I don't have to be part of that culture. And that's the beauty of music. It zits the most universal language. Eso I just I literally felt compelled to just shut everything down. Prue quarantine, which is kind of spooky, you know, I was feeling like I needed to return back to myself to the values you know, living in L. A. Is is exciting, and it's also it's a tough town. It's always the There's a lot of noise here, and and you could get distracted very easily. Um, you can get in with the wrong people very easily here and or vice versa. You can you go, you go the opposite way. And I just kind of have to listen to myself. It took a trip to London, England, made to make me realize that I needed to come back to the instrument and and literally unpack everything and just shut down from doing some pop music for a minute. Doesn't mean I'm not going to continue writing pop music, but it just means that I'm just throwing myself back at this instrument, ready to tour the world when it's ready. You know, in the next year to when we can kind of get back on the road, um, and bring just beautiful music again I needed in my life. So I thought, I figured if I need something, chances are it's going to connect with millions of millions of people. I've always listened to that instinct, and if I'm if I'm if I'm missing something, chances are that many people globally are missing that same thing as well. Yeah, and in the particular is the universal right that if you're feeling it like, that's another reason doubling down on yourself is, it ends up being universal on speaking universal. You know, looking at the track list. And, you know, these are, you know, many of life's most profound themes, like fracture change, nostalgia, Solis ghosts like I'm just reading, you know, Light. Um, I'm reading like These Air are song titles, and you're clearly not wrestling with trivial concepts here. Um, they're not, and I think, you know we don't have time to go into them. But I decided to put my my situation and and stories will roll out over time for me and I have. There's a story behind every song. As you said, you know, it's and the title. I even battled with the title of this album forever because you know it's to me. It's a story. It's It's like a male for a lot of ways. It's a male break up album. It's It's an album to be Thio wallow into Thio Watch be, keep you comforted on a rainy day to be sad to um, you know, Thio, as I said to you earlier to even to study to to be introspective, too. I mean, I do a lot of research reading, if you will, on the brain and the cortex. And you know, the tempo of music And what what? How Maney hit songs have been at specific tempos and why, for example, baroque music allows the brain to absorb more material because it typically baroque music at 60 bpm that opens up the cortex. You can enter more information. So a lot of that stuff goes into the thought process for me as well on. That's why I keep on using the word conversation because, um, I have to. I just I try to be as subjective as an honest as I am when I'm editing my piano stuff, and and sometimes if there is a mistake in it, because I mean you're gonna hear that in the wood of this instrument. I'm gonna let that slide. If the attitude of the notice correct. If that makes any sense, I don't care if there's like if there's a slightly wrong distance descendant note, but if I'm communicate, communicating the emotion, I'd rather keep that in rather than try to fix it up and clean it up. There's a there's a There's a book that someone gave to me a few years ago called Wabi Sabi and I don't know, you know, again, um, I have it on my shelf doing here the next next room directly above me have it's white with green green letters. You know it then, right. And in many ways it's allowing because things there's perfection and imperfection. I mean, grits the big thing. And I know that you're you. You are a big fan of that, and and with Angela, who has been on the show many times with you, I think, um, things are transient. Nothing's really everlasting if that makes sense and the and the more that you're able to, except that the better off I think you are, at least I am now. As an adult, I find that I'm or you know there's there's a calmness to me as you can tell my brain races. I stumble over my words half the time because I was always a victim of analysis over analysis, paralysis on, and that's what these albums are as well for me, their therapeutic, their healing because I got to get out of my own way. If that makes any sense, it does. But that's and that's like these these huge themes. And if you if you connect these huge themes, you're dissecting your own personal experience and you're doing it through action, right, you're not. You're just you're playing was it? Sounds like What does it feel like? What's the emotion? Is it working or not? Trusting your instinct like this is just this, like it's an amazing feedback loop that obviously has produced 16 16 insane tracks. Well, well, thank you. I mean, but, you know, people don't realize I probably recorded 2020 23 hours of music. Reduce it to three, reduce it to 52 minutes. And and that's you know, you know, in that process, it took me maybe, um, Tiu release This album is taking forever, to be honest, but the recording process has only taken a few months. If that we started talking about having on this show when you I believe back when you started recording right, we started. You started communicating a couple of years ago, and you know, I had taken Thio your social feeds and again, you know, you backlit with the French cinema in the background and glasses of red wine. And I'm like, Wow, this is really cool. And it's just you're doing your own thing and, you know, like, cool. I'm recording an album when the time is right. You know, I would. You know, I'd love to be on the show. Thanks for the invite, Chase. And that was two years ago. That was that Waas two years ago on and you know it, Z because I I connected clearly with with what you've been, you know, spreading for the last so many years on Did you as a creator yourself And I said, This guy gets it, um, and and there's so much that I I feel like I could share There's so much, um that I want to expose about the process. There's so much I wanna expose about. Sometimes when you say that the industry there's, you know, there's a lot of I think it's important to hear from a guy like me. You know, I worked with some of the most incredible artists. I'm not gonna call Incredible. I work with some of the most successful artists. But successful doesn't mean the best. Um, you know, I sit there and some of them truly are the best. I can sit there and tell you that Celinda on is one of the best singers in the world because she is, I mean, and she'll sit there for 12 hours until he gets every note. Right? Emotive. Lee and I've also worked with successful artist that I'm kind of laughing and going. Why the hell am I like spending my time and this person can't sing? And I'm trying to fix their notes there, saw their voice on auto tune and all of a sudden to become a big pop star, you feel a bit like a fraud at times. Um, you know that? I guess that's pop culture. You know, it's fabricated. You know, we always say we're living our best life on instagram. We don't show the gritty side, the bad side, the ugly side and and there's also an ugly side to music, and there's an ugly side to it. So I think you know, for me, I just just returned to the instrument that I'm most truthful with that's all. I just e come back to the word therapeutic and healing because the truth just sounds different. Though, you know, and Stephen from YouTube, Life says, there's no such thing is right. Sound bond. Wrong sound. There's just sound and your sound. This is the part where you said early on in our conversation, about sort of doubling down yourself, doubling down on what your own experiences are, doubling down on the experiences that can make you feel the emotions like fracture see change light. Um, exactly like you know, what does the process of learning to trust yourself look like? Because clearly, at some point, you didn't trust yourself. Sure, me, but the contrast when you didn't trust yourself and when you started Thio I think I think I just when I when I was hiding behind. That's not to say, Listen, when you're producing some with these artists doesn't mean that every time I'm hiding, but sometimes you can just kind of get buried and hide behind ah song and produce and and I was guilty of in the beginning where I would just even with production, I would just put element instrument after instrument after instrument Just thought wall of sounds better, bigger, the better. Then you quickly realize it's not, you know, and then you you realize and you study design. Then you study, you know, architecture, and you realize that if everything is built properly, it's like a salad. You go to a five star restaurant and and and you go simple salad. Why does it taste so great? It's because the lettuce was picked. Probably that day. Um, this is an amazing analogy, but this is amazing. Vinaigrette was made, but, I mean, you know, one of my favorite analogies that I want I wanna enlighten all of us, you know? Look, we live in an age now. I mean, if we asked anybody under the age of 25 everybody probably believes under the age of 25 that music should be free. We devalued music. Everything else has become mawr expensive in life. But we'll pay $4.95 for a Starbucks caramel frappuccino. It's in your stomach and it's gone, but we won't pay a dollar 29 for a single when my parents have probably spent thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars from my musical education put me through school. I've bled. I've you know, I've put in the hours and we think that we could play at 9 99. Spotify Membership Tohave Music Unlimited People have bled. They've gone to school. They've they've, they've they've studied for 10 15 20 years to create that song, to get in a relationship, to just be hurt badly, emotionally and bring you that piece of music that puts the goose bumps on you. I think music's healthier than that. Starbucks coffee for four bucks. Go spend the dollar 29 But we're too late. We've already taught people that music should be free, but that's again another sort of rant of a 40 something year old. But it Z, I don't know where I'm going. No, there's. But there's, however you show up to support artists. Maybe that's a reasonable take away right? You're if it's the bucks on Spotify mawr. Importantly, when we get out of this pandemic, it's showing up to see uh, performance live. And, you know, I've I've seen a couple of comments here again. They're flowing by people who have seen you live, and I think 11 word I saw was breathtaking. And to that end, can you play something else for us? I can. It's what? We're not in the room with you, but it feels damn close. And if you don't, if you have headphones on right now or you're listening on your phone is your on a walk around the lake? Or, um, maybe if you're at the gym when you sit down on the bench here and listened, um, I'm dying. It feels like I'm in the room with you. Maybe because I have some quality headphones on. But well, uh, just to that point before I play I I want to quickly talk about the fact that you know, to create the vibe in here. I What you don't see on the other side of this computer is that there's a pretty big floor, a big studio with three other acoustic pianos. You know, there's a big you know, I've got a big grand piano there, um, in a couple of the uprights and stuff like that, and I got an incredible engineer who's responsible for making sure even the podcast is well miked. Um, it sounds incredible. Thank you. That's J. Paul Bicknell now. Um, but when I did this album chase, I wanted to make sure that my this particular this is the piano room. This is an actual YSL booth that we transformed into a sort of mid century apartment to make it feel like like I was literally, like, living by myself. And the only thing I was I was a broken human being with an instrument and so that I can have this intimate relationship with with the piano. So on that note, I'll play you. And we created that in this this bigger complex here in Santa Monica. Um, in I will play you a song called Sea Change Again, Which this song I don't even know where it came from. On the album. I was just improvising, and all of a sudden I heard it. I said, Damn, I said, that just kind of came through through me. And, uh, here's sea change and thank you so much. E e O. Oh, wow. More goose bumps you talked about. Like like they're standing up on my arm. Um, that was sea change, uh, Stephen's new album and comes out on the 28th. But maybe all in different. Um, maybe the folks who are tracking this on my team can cut and paste away to pre order that. Sure we'll take Yeah, for sure. We want to make sure that that's in there. And, um, again, Stefan Macchio tell us, uh, the space comment you made right before you started playing resonated with myself and with a handful of folks in the comments here, Gina particularly wants to Here's talk about this physical environment you created essentially a mood. I wrote about it in, uh, creative calling. And you mentioned architecture's great book, E. I mean, I haven't I haven't No, we'll talk about that at some other point. You know, it's, um, this, you know, architectural. You've mentioned this space you're talking about how how things make you feel and I'm talk to me about about that, about the environment. You set up for yourself as a creator. When you step into the studio, I think that's, you know, an addendum to the your earlier question. You were talking about process. I think, you know, into success to ensure and whatever success means success doesn't mean like, you know, fame and all that kind of bullshit it just means success in creating something authentic and pure. So in order to do that, um, you have to again, you have to just kind of itt's bit of homework to do and, you know, preliminary work beforehand. You know, I wanted to create a very intimate dialogue between the piano and I. So, um, when I came back from Christmas 2018 I was on January 1st January 2nd, you know, I had piano was brand new, and we were just way I knew the sound I was after. So I went for that felted sound. I knew that I had to create an environment with candles and and, you know, just person rug and just make it look like a sort of half beat up apartment and feel like I had to kind of get there. Because every element the MAWR senses you are able to awaken the MAWR. You feel that the experience is authentic and pure. That makes any sense. So it's like going to a Circus Soleil show. Um, sometimes, you know, they even pump stuff in the in the air as oxygen and some some sense. And the music's another sense. The visuals and other senses. So the more that you can awaken, um, the more that it's going to be believable and truthful. So, uh, and the same thing goes I mean, you know, kind of what I'm working with my homies or I'm working on a hip hop track. I'm not, You know, I'm not gonna be bringing scented candles, you know, to that session per se, it's You have to You just you know, you've got to be yourself, whatever that means. I mean, just, you know, you have to be in a place where you're not you're just you're calm and collected, but you also doing your research is such a big part of that process and creating that environment which is going to create, I think, you know, if my my this little room didn't look the way it did, I don't I think that it adds 10% value to the I sound. I really do. I e I couldn't agree more in this idea of how many creators out there have taken a second and thought about when you feel the most creative when you're the most connected, what your environment, what are the people What is the place? What did you do before? What did you do during what did you do after? And this is what riel professional artists do. They goto work and doesn't have to be perfect. And right now, if you don't have a studio space you don't have, you can create, you know, in it I've talked about when I didn't have, uh, space that I wanted or when I like what I did and you could be, it could be a simple if, if you need to create while you're on the subway on the train on the way to work, the maybe the best thing you can invest in is a $200 set of noise canceling headphones. If that could put you in the space, it's not like whatever the thing is for you and doing what you can with what you have is if I'm going to extract what I'm hearing from Stephens comments there. It's the people who do this professional. They craft the experience that they want to have. Sure, it may be privileged to be ableto own the fancy Yamaha piano or to be able to have the felt applied and customized. Maybe the candles, all these things. But if you are a professional and you sit down to Goto work, you might as well create the environment architecturally, emotionally, conceptually, spiritually. Whatever it is that you have created that makes your heart sing when you performed your best. This is why athletes have rituals. This is why it's not an accident. 100%. I mean, I get so upset when somebody says, Well, I don't have the fancy microphones. Let's bullshit. I mean, I didn't have the fancy microphones and I took the risk of myself. You know, you you go broke and and you you If you believe in yourself, you got something to say. There's no one else is going to believe in you more than you. You have to do it. And the flip side to the comment on creating space, everything. I concur with everything you just said. I also know because I'm guilty of it is too much fussiness. We do it when we're nervous. You know, the great architect Frank Gehry says every time before he starts a project, he just makes sure his pencils are in the right place, and the paper is the right way, and he sits and stares at it for like hours because it's not until you put your first strike and you kind of go, Where's that c sharp gonna lead me to right now? It could lead me to or or this on. You make decision after decision after decision after decision, and you have to be so confident. Your decisions, um, and also you have to know that it's okay to make the wrong decision. And but this is This is like people ask what it's like to be a professional and goto work. This this is to me that is one of the biggest gaps in our culture and understanding what, and you do not have to. To be crystal clear, you do not have to. If you're watching this listening to step on, you do not have to be a professional musician. You don't have to be a professional artist to get value out of exercising your own creativity. But if you want to, or if you want to develop your craft in such a way as the professionals develop it, listen to what step is saying. This is what true professionals do when they go toe work. What worked last time? What mood do I want to create? What? You know what headspace is it helpful to be in and doing what you can to put you talked about? Ah, bunch of life changes that you have just recently gone through? You sat in those in order to create this. That is what a professional does. I I You know, ah, lot of people are probably listen to this. And they're not near a Mecca center like l. A or New York, and and I need to remind them I I born in a small town. I don't I was never lived here. And, you know, I had to move here physically. I had to apply for immigration, get, you know, come across, you know, it z complex stuff. But it was all driven by my passion for music. You think about it. It was aldrin because I felt like I had something to say. Um, you know, professional doesn't mean better. It just means that you're getting paid to do what you love to do. But at one point, every professional to take a risk on themselves and and there are probably sometimes even better piano players living in Arkansas, possibly, just. But, you know, if you're not gonna put yourself in the arena to be showcased, that you can't complain, you have to. There's so much, um, again, I the failure part is so important. It's so it's important to be able to make mistakes and then get back up. And to know that you know the Onley way that you're going to grow the Onley way that you're gonna get better is when you find out that that's not as nice as that. And so so just just do it like literally just do it. That's the best advice, and it comes, it comes. It's easy to receive that in a hard way if you are stuck right now. And so I'm looking at you who might be looking at me and be stuck right now. You have to listen, Stefan. You have Thio because there is nothing else. If you're in, um, your parent's basement making music and you want toe, have a voice that changes lives and impacts others you do not have to. You can have. You can extract all of the value of art for yourself just in the creative process. But if you want to do something more than that, it's on you. If you don't believe in you, who will write as you've just said, Um, Vanessa, Julio Sheila Another Stefan. Another Gary Joe Wan Again. We've got a global audience that are asking if you've got time for one more. We're coming up on 90 minutes, and I want to make sure that you've played everything that you want to play. Stefan. I'm thinking I mean, there's so much you know you've got this is a huge album, too. By the way, 16 tracks on the piano, that's I mean wow. Yes. And you said you wrote 20 something hours with the music I wrote 23 hours. Plus, um, listen to all 23 hours. You know, I reduced to approximately three hours and then eventually those three hours. You know, technically, I have, you know, two more albums in the can and ready to go. It's just that I, you know, the the the art of the album is lost in today's playlist world, which is not a bad thing or good thing. But I still, you know, being a bit old school myself. I love artists who have visions when, for example, when Picasso says, I'm gonna go through my blue period, you know, for so many years Picasso's painting Just Blue Black paintings and there's There's There's Consistency. So, for example, pre the playlist, you know, when I would listen to great soundtracks and film scores I love that would allow me to study or read to. In University, there was always one or two songs that came off the score that just didn't make sense, and you have to get up and change it. So I think that was another element that, you know, curating the order of the songs for me, the vinyl that's coming up for this album. It was so important, um, that everything is sort of like made sense, and I had a flow to it. But I'll stop talking because no, no. Can I make sure before I wanna put a put my bid in for the vinyl? When it comes out, you could give me the head. They get so excited about the vinyl because I just I heard a test of it a few weeks ago, and it sounds it's You know, for those of us who grew up with vinyl, it puts you right in a in a head space in a place. Um uh oh, Blanche, Because I'm French as well. This just means, like, sleepless night. And haven't we all had sleepless nights? Um, that's this piece, E o. It's a bad, incredible, uh, Stefan Macchio, for those of you joined late. Um, congratulations on your new album. Congratulations on all those Grammy and Academy Nam's and, uh, hit songs with Celine Dion the weekend My Cyrus seal E could, you know, And I know it's funny we say those things because we have to say them, but and they give context to who the person is. But, you know, here I am, on the other side of it, it's just, you know, I'm just still struggling at the end of the day to just put out great music. It's all it's all, it's all it is. It's just like you get out of bed every time, every day and your your your your goal is okay. So I did that. I mean, you have to push it forward, and then I look back at my life It's exciting to say that stuff, but more importantly, um, half the time I'm tormented on, you know that the cords that I'm wrestling with that day or the sound of the piano and, you know and how it's going to you know, I I just say this chase because again, I've been there. I've been in that house. I've been, you know, 14 years old, frustrated, knowing I was going to, you know, create Melies, that the world was going to sing. But I just didn't know how I was going to get there, didn't know how it's going to get there. And I had those questions and and I'm just kind of trying to answer those questions for my 13 14 15 year old self. Um, and it's just you just keep on doing it. You know David Foster. It's just so serendipitous that you had him on. But I mean, he's a Canadian like myself, but he'd heard me play when I was 18 and David said to me when I was 18 says, All I know is that you are you have the potentially world class. You are amazing, but no one's gonna do it. Other than you. You have to keep on trucking. Just keep on moving forward, you know? And here we are, 25 years later, friendship, and, um, it zits, that same thing. You know, the answer is not an easy one. And people think that it's just gonna be all of a sudden this this magical answer and it's gonna be Oh, hey, man, it's gonna open up. It's just work, work. Just work your passion, work your passion. Do I mean, when I'm doing a project, a lot of times, I put signs up and say, Follow your gut, meaning Don't try to be something else musically that you're not. And every time that I do that like I try to be who I am, it works. It's just connects with people. And you have to You have to remind yourself sometimes. Well, I want to echo comment that I just read from Ash Jensen, which is big. Thank you to ever whoever had you start playing the piano. Must have been Your parents thought it was my parents. Thank you. Well, grateful, uh, them during you and of course, more grateful for all of the decades of work. You put in. Congratulations. It's been incredible to have you on the show. Um, and just a quick recap. New album, Um, tales of solis out in 30 days here, Um, there's a couple of links in the comments below. If you're watching where you can preorder that order when it comes out. Um, Stefan Macchio, Uh, somewhere around 3 to 4 years in the making to have you on the show, and I'm glad we were patient. And congrats on the new album. Um, any place you'd like to steer, folks? I know your your stuff on Macchio at on most of the social channels where I pay attention to you. That's S t e p h a N M 0 cc I o. If you are, uh, listening now and you want to go follow anywhere else, you'd steer folks who want to get more of what we just sampled here in our conversation today. No, I mean, you said all the socials and of course, streaming platforms, apple music and Spotify Deezer. I mean the Amazon. If anything, um, I hope that I get to see many of you when I had the chance to tour whenever that will become possible is well, I mean, you know, when you think about how that's impacted artists in the last 34 months I mean, that's, you know, artists livelihood that can't go out and perform. So we have avenues like this on your show. Thio bring the music to people. But I just hope that you come up and experience the live show because that's for me in my art. That's where it's at the the live experience. I will trust that you will let me know and I will be happy to share that with, uh, creative community that pays attention to what I'm doing. And again, so grateful. Um, look forward to connecting the next time I'm in l. A or that we're able to travel on. And for those of you who may be curious, we are going to continue this conversation for just a few more minutes over at my instagram. We're gonna do a little instagram live momentarily and the same if if you follow uh, Stefan, he will. I think he's gonna join My I g live is that we're gonna dio s. So I'm gonna dio Alright, Alright. Thank you. So much for being on this show. I am grateful. And all of the folks who behind the scenes made this happen Adam and John and NASA and Julie on our end on I know you've got some management and labels and all those things that again, long time in the making to build the performing songs that are not yet out Live on the air. I want to say thanks to everyone involved. So signing off chase, you are amazing. Amazing. Thank you. Really Thank you for what you do. Well, thank you, man. You're you're the star today in Bask in it And, uh, we'll see all over at on my channel here shortly Until then, Hopefully tomorrow. Stay tuned. Mm, yeah.